Difference between revisions of "Category talk:Sailor Moon's Influence on Other Works"

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::They're not though, Saint Seiya is a quintessential shounen...--[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 03:28, 14 August 2006 (MST)
 
::They're not though, Saint Seiya is a quintessential shounen...--[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 03:28, 14 August 2006 (MST)
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:::I came across this today [[http://stayka.homelinux.net/seiya/texte/smoon/st-smoon.html]] , should we create a page about it here and credit the website?--[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 03:07, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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::::...why? All the comparisons on that site are, IMHO, very much of a stretch. So two characters used fire. So two characters had wings. That doesn't mean they're influenced by each other any more than any other anime series. [[User:Kerochan no Miko|Kerochan no Miko]] 03:27, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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::::: There are other similarities too. I am actually in the process of trying to get a discussion going on a Saint Seiya forum about the similarities between both titles and compile a longer list, with relevant images form there. I'll link the thread for you if you like, when it has progressed enough, you can decide if Saint Seiya deserves a page. [[http://saintseiyafan.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3465.0]]--[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 05:57, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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::::::Given the fact that Saint Seiya came ''before'' Sailor Moon, it doesn't belong in this category at all. I'm not sure why you're bothering. [[User:Kerochan no Miko|Kerochan no Miko]] 06:12, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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:::::::''If'' what Ohtori_akio suggested above is deemed to be valid, then we should create the category "Other Works' Influence on Sailor Moon" & a relevant article under it. --[[User:210|210]] 08:03, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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::::::::That's a very large "if" and I currently see no reason to create a new category for ''one thing''. 9_9 [[User:Kerochan no Miko|Kerochan no Miko]] 15:11, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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:::::::::Ok, if that's how you see it, I won't bother exploing it further --[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 15:56, 10 January 2010 (MST)
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:::::::::If Ohtori_akio's suggestion (or any similar ones made by others) is really valid, then I think there should be a new category even if there'd be only one article under it for the time being, but since he's already retracted it himself, we don't need to consider that for now. --[[User:210|210]] 01:19, 11 January 2010 (MST)
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::::::::::Ok, I know I said I would drop this but I came across  passage in this book [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manga:_The_Complete_Guide]] where the author states "the combat scenes seemed heavily influenced by Saint Seiya, but shorter and less bloody". I also came across this page as well [[http://saintseiyaforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5175#p209790]] which gives us a little brief of Kazuko Tadano's work on Saint Seiya. IF we do have a page on Saint Seiya in whatever section, should we have a list of notable Sailor Moon staff members and their work on the previous title, and how their skills evolved in order to produce Sailor Moon?--[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 22:53, 11 January 2010 (MST)
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:::::::::::Ohtori akio, we've already established that this argument does not belong on this talk page. I suggest that you find "whatever section" you think it belongs in and make your arguments there instead of spamming an unrelated talk page. [[User:Kerochan no Miko|Kerochan no Miko]] 22:57, 11 January 2010 (MST)
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::::::::::::Ohtori akio, maybe you could raise the issue here: [[WikiMoon:Reference desk]]. ; ) BTW, I think what you've raised here is very interesting, even tho I'm not fluent in ''Saint Seiya''. ^^ --[[User:210|210]] 23:06, 11 January 2010 (MST)
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:::::::::::::210, thanks for the heads up! I just came across your message now after I finished my first draft of the Saint seiya article. I would need some help with formatting the page though, so if you are up for it, I would love your help! Should I still post something about this on the Reference desk? --[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 23:37, 11 January 2010 (MST)
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::::::::::::::I think you gotta show convincingly how ''Saint Seiya'' has influenced ''Sailor Moon'' 1st before any formatting can take place, since if you can't do that, the article will be deleted. Also, since you've already created that article, discussions about it can now be done on its talk page, hence you no longer need to talk about it on the Reference desk nor this page ; ) (I'm writing here just for answering your above question - if you've any more questions about it, pls ask on that talk page). I do hope you can prove that influence if it really exists. ^^ --[[User:210|210]] 08:03, 12 January 2010 (MST)
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I don't know if anyone here watches Super Gals but they parody Sailor Moon in the episode titled Shibuya Soldier♥Mystery→Maru-Q Moon, should this go here? --[[User:Ohtori akio|Ohtori_akio]] 02:30, 25 October 2008 (MST)
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:Why not if that's the case? ^^ --[[User:210|210]] 22:25, 25 October 2008 (MST)
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:Perhaps under [[:Category:Parody]].--[[User:210|210]] 22:34, 25 October 2008 (MST)

Latest revision as of 04:19, 16 January 2010

Just wondering if I should create a page on Sailor Moon's influence on Wedding Peach because this is one of the more obvious ones and there are quite a few connections, be it the design of their outfits to the headquarters of the villains, to the character interaction etc... Just taking a vote on that before I create one. Thanks for your feedbackOhtori_akio 02:38, 8 July 2006 (MST)

I'm not very familiar with Wedding Peach but I guess it's a possibility, if you can prove it's been more influenced than the average magical girl show. Incidentally, much of this influence is probably due to Wedding Peach having been created by Sukehiro Tomita, who was a writer for Sailor Moon's first three seasons. Dooky 02:48, 8 July 2006 (MST)
I think they also have the same character designer as most things about Wedding Peach remind me about Sailor Moon. The design for the Love Angels and the Devils are very much like the ones of the soldiers and Youmas. Wedding Peach also parodies Sailor Moon in a special that they had as an extra on one of the dvds. It involved Angel Salvia using a made=up attack that looked a LOT like Jupiter Oak Evolution.... Wedding Peach's attack also looks a lot like Sailor Moon's ones witht he wands and everything. Angel Lily had one attack that's a lot like Moon Spiral Heart Attack. Here's a site that has some pics to show the similarities
http://www.tcp.com/doi/wpeach/index.html Ohtori_akio 03:08, 8 July 2006 (MST)
And don't forget the wedding theme - what's Usagi's biggest wish for her future "career"? lol Ok, j/k. My opinion is go ahead & try it, as the 2 works have so many obvious similarities and Wedding Peach came after Sailormoon. 210.245.162.185 03:29, 8 July 2006 (MST)
Wedding Peach is undeniably influenced by Sailor Moon, it's plotline is very similar to the first seasons plotline. I enjoyed the Wedding Peach manga a lot (I have a WP website) but I won't denie the influence is very obvious but in, the manga at least, it sort of comes of as almost a tribute or a mild pastiche of Sailor Moon than an out-and-out copy as there are plenty of diffrences too. I have an essay on the subject on my site [1] in Essays on Wedding Peach, bear in mind my essay is mostly based on the WP manga as I haven't seen the anime yet. GracieLizzie 05:46, 8 July 2006 (MST)

Do we need to make individual pages for every series that shows an influence, or do we do like the "cameos" page and just list them all together? And do we want to list any magical girl anime with a team, or just those with blatant Sailor Moon references? And what about Venus 5? :P Kerochan no Miko 11:17, 8 July 2006 (MST)

I think Venus 5 definitely deserves its own page too. It's obviously a sendup of Sailor Moon. Have you seen the cat that looks just like Artemis and behave like a pervert? Should we also include Sailor and the 7 ballz down the track?Ohtori_akio 16:15, 8 July 2006 (MST)

Sailor Moon and Wedding Peach should be added to the listOhtori_akio 17:11, 8 July 2006 (MST)

I think whether a work warrents a page here depends on the degree of Sailormoon's influence, and this, of course, is a matter of judgment, and as someone said, on a case-by-case basis. So how the article is written is very important for this judgment & whether it should be included. 210.245.162.185 17:42, 8 July 2006 (MST)

Just wondering if an article about Saint Seiya's influence on Sailor Moon should be added here. --Ohtori_akio 23:38, 11 August 2006 (MST)

Before writing your article, would you pls provide some info about this? (I'm a Saint Seiya dummy, tho I know it has sthg to do w/ astrological myths.) 210 03:12, 12 August 2006 (MST)
As you point out yourself, they both have a mystical basis. Sailor Moon is based on planets and their myths. Saint Seiya does the same with Greek and a few other mythologies. The main cast of Saint Seiya are 5 saints who fight to protect Athena. They have similar themed powers as the Sailor Soldiers (Water/Ice, Fire, Chains and a few thunder attacks). The lead character is a little rashed and doesn't really think before taking action (like Usagi). One of the enemies, Fenrir has a pack of wolfs as his companions and the leader bares a crescent moon on his forehead... Zoisite shares a voice actor with Aphrodite (another gay character who's gender was altered in a dub). When Ziosite asks to die beautiful in the anime, the roses that surrround him are very similar to Aphrodite's death scene in Saint Seiya. These are just a few examplesand I'm certain I can find a few more. The Anime Encyclopedia also states that Saint Seiya has influenced Sailor Moon....--Ohtori_akio 03:32, 12 August 2006 (MST)
Aside from observational similarities, are there any authoritative sources that say so, e.g. staff interviews, any words from Takeuchi herself, etc.? BTW, if you go ahead w/ this article, I think it should be in another category rather than this 1. 210 03:42, 12 August 2006 (MST)
There aren't any interviews that say so as such. I don't know if anyone's ever talked about it and I will research that further. I remember hearing somewhere that TOEI was interested in creating Sailor Moon because of the success they had had with Saint Seiya previously... For a title the article could be "Saint Seiya's influence on Sailor Moon" I suppose...--Ohtori_akio 03:46, 12 August 2006 (MST)

^ Oh, I meant the category title, but your article title seems fine. And yes, do more research on it, & hear other users' opinions about this. 210 04:03, 12 August 2006 (MST)

I don't really see any reason to have a separate article for Saint Seiya unless it can be tied in more to Sailor Moon - I think saying that it has similar themes/characters/setup is sufficient, as this sounds more like "same genre" than "influenced by". Kerochan no Miko 06:10, 12 August 2006 (MST)
They're not though, Saint Seiya is a quintessential shounen...--Ohtori_akio 03:28, 14 August 2006 (MST)
I came across this today [[2]] , should we create a page about it here and credit the website?--Ohtori_akio 03:07, 10 January 2010 (MST)
...why? All the comparisons on that site are, IMHO, very much of a stretch. So two characters used fire. So two characters had wings. That doesn't mean they're influenced by each other any more than any other anime series. Kerochan no Miko 03:27, 10 January 2010 (MST)
There are other similarities too. I am actually in the process of trying to get a discussion going on a Saint Seiya forum about the similarities between both titles and compile a longer list, with relevant images form there. I'll link the thread for you if you like, when it has progressed enough, you can decide if Saint Seiya deserves a page. [[3]]--Ohtori_akio 05:57, 10 January 2010 (MST)
Given the fact that Saint Seiya came before Sailor Moon, it doesn't belong in this category at all. I'm not sure why you're bothering. Kerochan no Miko 06:12, 10 January 2010 (MST)
If what Ohtori_akio suggested above is deemed to be valid, then we should create the category "Other Works' Influence on Sailor Moon" & a relevant article under it. --210 08:03, 10 January 2010 (MST)
That's a very large "if" and I currently see no reason to create a new category for one thing. 9_9 Kerochan no Miko 15:11, 10 January 2010 (MST)
Ok, if that's how you see it, I won't bother exploing it further --Ohtori_akio 15:56, 10 January 2010 (MST)
If Ohtori_akio's suggestion (or any similar ones made by others) is really valid, then I think there should be a new category even if there'd be only one article under it for the time being, but since he's already retracted it himself, we don't need to consider that for now. --210 01:19, 11 January 2010 (MST)
Ok, I know I said I would drop this but I came across passage in this book [[4]] where the author states "the combat scenes seemed heavily influenced by Saint Seiya, but shorter and less bloody". I also came across this page as well [[5]] which gives us a little brief of Kazuko Tadano's work on Saint Seiya. IF we do have a page on Saint Seiya in whatever section, should we have a list of notable Sailor Moon staff members and their work on the previous title, and how their skills evolved in order to produce Sailor Moon?--Ohtori_akio 22:53, 11 January 2010 (MST)
Ohtori akio, we've already established that this argument does not belong on this talk page. I suggest that you find "whatever section" you think it belongs in and make your arguments there instead of spamming an unrelated talk page. Kerochan no Miko 22:57, 11 January 2010 (MST)
Ohtori akio, maybe you could raise the issue here: WikiMoon:Reference desk. ; ) BTW, I think what you've raised here is very interesting, even tho I'm not fluent in Saint Seiya. ^^ --210 23:06, 11 January 2010 (MST)
210, thanks for the heads up! I just came across your message now after I finished my first draft of the Saint seiya article. I would need some help with formatting the page though, so if you are up for it, I would love your help! Should I still post something about this on the Reference desk? --Ohtori_akio 23:37, 11 January 2010 (MST)
I think you gotta show convincingly how Saint Seiya has influenced Sailor Moon 1st before any formatting can take place, since if you can't do that, the article will be deleted. Also, since you've already created that article, discussions about it can now be done on its talk page, hence you no longer need to talk about it on the Reference desk nor this page ; ) (I'm writing here just for answering your above question - if you've any more questions about it, pls ask on that talk page). I do hope you can prove that influence if it really exists. ^^ --210 08:03, 12 January 2010 (MST)

I don't know if anyone here watches Super Gals but they parody Sailor Moon in the episode titled Shibuya Soldier♥Mystery→Maru-Q Moon, should this go here? --Ohtori_akio 02:30, 25 October 2008 (MST)

Why not if that's the case? ^^ --210 22:25, 25 October 2008 (MST)
Perhaps under Category:Parody.--210 22:34, 25 October 2008 (MST)