WikiMoon:Community Portal/Talk Archives 1

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This archive was created on the 1st of September, 2006. It contains discussions from the Community Portal dating from the launch of the site (13th of May, 2006) which were inactive as of the 1st of August, 2006.

Front page design

I've been working on something along the lines of Wikipedia/Memory Alpha... you can see the current design here. Any thoughts? Dooky 09:33, 27 May 2006 (MST)

It looks good, whenever you're ready to run with it, go.--WikiSysop 10:07, 27 May 2006 (MST)
My one concern is having something at the end of all the links on the front page (particularly the ones pointing to general manga/myu/whatever pages). I'll probably turn the existing front page into the Welcome page, but I'll still need something for the others. Dooky 10:11, 27 May 2006 (MST)
Want to wait on this until we have something at those pages?--WikiSysop 10:19, 27 May 2006 (MST)
Yeah. It probably won't take long to knock up a few introductory pages linking to other things. I'd also like to get something on these privacy/about/disclaimer/copyright pages before too long. Dooky 10:41, 27 May 2006 (MST)

The purge of the esoteric

Tomorrow I'm going to get rid of all of the articles currently listed under Category:Esoteric and Irrelevant Articles. If you want to save any of them, this is your last chance! Dooky 14:44, 3 June 2006 (MST)

Troublesome names

Well, currently I only have one troublesome name, but feel free to post here if you're having trouble deciding what to call an article.

My problem right now stems from the second set of transformation pens given to the Sailor Team in episode 62. In the anime, as well as all of the relevant guides, they are referred to simply as transformation pens (just like their predecessors). However, they were marketed as toys under the name Star Power Stick. So how do we refer to them? We're quite regularly using merchandise names for items in SuperS and Stars, which is made necessary by the lack of guides for those series. So should we go with the merchandise name here as well, or should we stick to what the guide says (ie, that they're just called transformation pens)? Ordinarily I'd consider an official guide more reliable than a toy manufacturer, but in this case we have a more specific term on offer from the toy company. However, I kind of get the impression that the name may have been plucked out of the air by the toy manufacturers just to differentiate the toys from the previous set of transformation pens... and if that's so, it also calls into question certain items from SuperS and Stars, whose only name sources are tie-in toys... Dooky 17:57, 15 June 2006 (MST)

I refer to objects used in transformations as simply "alpha devices", differentiating among them by the series in which each was first used, calling them "level one", "level two" and so on. -- DENelson83 21:58, 15 June 2006 (MST)
That's fine for personal use, but we can't use it to name articles. What I'm basically asking here is: should the second pens go in a general "transformation pens" article with the first pens (as official sources suggest they had no unique name) or should the artcle be called "Star Power Stick", the name used for the toy versions? Dooky 22:06, 15 June 2006 (MST)
Personally, I think that all the transformation pens could be lumped together in one article with a note that the merchandise gave them a name that wasn't used anywhere in the series - they didn't really differentiate themselves in any way from each other except in appearance and apparent power boost. Kerochan no Miko 22:27, 15 June 2006 (MST)
I can't figure out why the Star Power Sticks were ever referred to as simply transformation pens by the Nakayoshi anime albums because... they're not pens. Nor are the transformation wands used in SuperS... Furthermore, I think they should be in separate articles. You don't lump the Cutie Moon Rod, Spiral Heart Moon Rod, Kaliedo Moon Scope, and Eternal Tier all in one article, just because they all originated from the original object (Cutie Moon Rod).--Dianne 15:37, 18 June 2006 (MST)
Yeah, but those things all have well-established names. I take your point though, and I'd like to see the two forms of the pens given their own articles. The only question is what to call them. Ordinarily I'd go with Star Power Stick (we've used merchandise as the base of article names in other cases), but the problem is that it's kind of contradicted by a source closer to the series. Regarding the pen/stick issue... The dictionary section of the R Nakayoshi guide uses "Transformation Pen", but one of the captions in the Episode 62 summary uses "Transformation Stick", so you could argue that the animators just hadn't decided on a name for these things.
Incidentally, I'd consider "Transformation Pen" as a term that encompasses the original pens, plus their later forms, along with the Outer Senshi's Lip Rods... just as "Transformation Brooch", while specifically referring to Sailor Moon's original brooch, could also refer to any other brooch used by Sailor Moon or Sailor Chibi Moon. At the very least, we'd want links in these articles pointing to the later forms. Dooky 16:35, 18 June 2006 (MST)

Splitting the Senshi articles

Most of the Senshi artciles are growing nicely, and I think soon we'll be able to split them into separate Senshi and civilian articles, as we discussed earlier (er, somewhere, anyway...) What we now have to decide is what information goes into what articles. Here's my suggestions:

  • Senshi articles: Details on awakening, powers, transformations, who knows their identity, plus details on any previous incarnation(s).
  • Civilian articles: Details on character background, personality etc.
  • Stuff that could go in either article, but we should probably decide which: A history of the character's exploits throughout the series, and character trivia (although this could be split between the two depending on how specific it is).

So, does anyone have a different? Is there anything I've missed here? Dooky 13:58, 18 June 2006 (MST)

One article for senshi form and one article for civilian form would work for most of them, but what about Usagi and her many personalities? Kerochan no Miko 14:21, 18 June 2006 (MST)
There's no reason why we couldn't do the same for them. There's already a Princess Sailor Moon article and a (rather minimalist) Neo Queen Serenity article, plus a Moonlight Knight article. In cases such as these, I guess we'd have to describe background, unique powers and so on. If they have a pesonality distinct from their usual form (as is the case with the Moonlight Knight and Princess Sailor Moon) we should talk about that too.

A more contentious issue is that of Super Sailor Senshi. I'm in favour of separate articles for those too, but ther are some who disagree, and I can see both sides, to be honest. These articles would probably be fairly small, but there's nothing wrong with small articles if they're sufficiently comprehensive, and if they linked back to the main Senshi article then I don't really see a problem. However, this further splitting might be a step for some time in the future, once the Senshi articles have been beefed up a bit more. Dooky 14:36, 18 June 2006 (MST)

The problem I forsee with giving say, Super Sailor Mars, an article is when it comes to the manga only Star/Starry Uniform/Eternal forms of the senshi which I don't think ever got an official name, what do we call them? Sailor Mars (manga only form) or something like that (did they get these forms in the musicals) but it's a bit messy looking. GracieLizzie 06:58, 19 June 2006 (MST)
Yes, I did wonder about this, and I assumed someone more familiar with the manga would have an answer ^_^;; Does the form come with any new powers, or does it require a new transformation phrase? If so, then it probably does merit a separate article. Until we've decided on how to name them, though, we can just mention these forms in the regular senshi articles. While it would be nice to aim for consistency ultimately, we don't have to create all of these articles at the same time. Dooky 07:55, 19 June 2006 (MST)
I know Sailors Uranus and Neptune get two new powers afterward but I'm not so sure about everyone else. I've never read Stars as they'd gone out of print by the time I wanted to buy them :( GracieLizzie 08:19, 19 June 2006 (MST)


Looks like this wiki has just had its first incident of vandalism... -- DENelson83 00:35, 17 July 2006 (MST)

It was by no means the first incident here, but this was the first persistent attack. Given the scale of it, I'm quite impressed by how quickly it was turned around. The IP traces back to AOL, not that it really matters now. Dooky 00:55, 17 July 2006 (MST)
Whenever global resources are affected, the effect immediately spreads globally, hence the scale & speed. So they warrant priority of protection. 210 01:09, 17 July 2006 (MST)

All he did was waste his own time. I mean, that really took effort, changing IPs and then manually selecting articles. I hope he enjoys being that much of a loser with nothing better to do with his life, although odds are it's just some stupid twelve year old.

Kero sent me an IM about it so I was able to take care of things quickly once I found where the ban IP button was. In any case, I've banned the AOL IP range and as Sushil said, we're probably the better for it. Unless there's a real reason to unban AOL, we can keep it this way. I think that many of the templates should be protected to registered users only. I'll leave that to your discretion, dooky.--WikiSysop 01:21, 17 July 2006 (MST)

I agree, I'll set the permissions for the templates. A few of the templates (the front page ones) were already protected like this, but there's no harm in doing the same for the others. If you haven't registered then you've no business messing with the framework of the site anyway. Dooky 01:29, 17 July 2006 (MST)
You've banned the whole AOL IP range? I don't think it's fair for everyone who uses AOL to be banned just because of the actions of one jerk. It seems like overkill to me. GracieLizzie 03:41, 17 July 2006 (MST)
As a victim of block banning of a Japanese board myself (I even haven't posted on that board once), I can understand this. However, as an emergency measure, I think it's appropriate for the time being even tho it's unfair. And yes, the templates must be protected. Even a novice vandalist could by chance select some of them & cause extensive effects. And this one is not totally novice - s/he'd selected the user pages of only the admins to attack. Moreover, s/he choosed to use disturbing images at a Sailormoon site for his/her pathological psycho-satisfaction or scaring off users/viewers from here. 210 04:07, 17 July 2006 (MST)
I'm actually curious if these bans simply block anonymous users or also block account creation. I think if you already had an account you'd be fine, as I don't think the site asks for your IP address if you're logged in, but I've no idea if new accounts can be submitted for the range. Dooky 06:41, 17 July 2006 (MST)

^ You may do experiments for that if you know someone of that range. 210 07:04, 17 July 2006 (MST)

Thanks to some wazzock vandalising the front page templates, they're now editable by sysops only. Should probably have set this sooner, but meh. dooky 11:10, 19 July 2006 (MST)
It finally happened. Now I wonder if we should protect other templates in the same way as any vandalist can create an A/C here. BTW, since I'm a non-native English speaker, what's the meaning of "wazzock"? ^^; 210 17:48, 19 July 2006 (MST)
Protecting the front page templates is really the top priority. I don't want to fully protect the others because templates aren't op-only territory... regular users should be making and editing them too. There is no way of preventing wiki vandalism: part of running a wiki is being vigilant and keeping an eye out for vandalism.
Oh, and "wazzock" is a British slang term for "idiot" ^_^ dooky 19:39, 19 July 2006 (MST)

New address range, same images, admins targeted, could be the same vandalist(s). DEN has reverted them so far. 210 19:15, 20 July 2006 (MST)

The block method in wiki is retarded, I blocked the range and it did nothing. So I've banned AOL via .htaccess.--WikiSysop 14:39, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Here's a list of IP addresses AOL uses. Does that help you? -- DENelson83 14:42, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Oops... It appears that while attempting to watch recent changes to see if that vandal did anything else, I refreshed the page too often and got 403'd. -- DENelson83 14:48, 21 July 2006 (MST)

No, I'm playing with the .htaccess. I can't get the wiki subdirectory .htaccess to work. Right now the AOL block is in all of our server, which includes and we don't want to block AOL users from that.

I'm no Apache expert, but maybe it has something to do with referring URL's? -- DENelson83 15:39, 21 July 2006 (MST)

While supporting the admins' actions at this stage, I'm also wondering if 1 of the vandalist's objectives is to lead us to limit the # of potential users/viewers accessing here. 210 18:42, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Point taken, but I suspect you're crediting them with way too much intelligence. dooky 18:45, 21 July 2006 (MST)
Just want to be prepared for any possible worst-case scenarios. It's my (bad) occupational habit. ^^; 210 18:53, 21 July 2006 (MST)

I have removed the AOL block from the server htaccess and blocked the IPs listed at the page Denelson posted. Luckily it matches with the block method in MediaWiki's help page. Hopefully it works.--WikiSysop 21:59, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Just making sure you know that MediaWiki properly interprets CIDR expressions of IP address ranges. What you were doing before was only inputting "default network" addresses, and of course no single computer uses such an IP number. -- DENelson83 23:09, 21 July 2006 (MST)
I had thought it worked like most normal places which let you put a 0 or a star to count all but dooky sent me this earlier which matched the IP list you posted, so I think it'll block all of AOL now.--WikiSysop 23:36, 21 July 2006 (MST)
Seems like DEN's list works. Kudos again to DEN! But we gotta continue to be alert. 210 19:13, 22 July 2006 (MST)

Sailor Moon (first season) anime episode summaries

In-depth summaries for episodes #39-ja through #46-ja still need to be written. (Points at Dooky) -- DENelson83 01:46, 18 July 2006 (MST)

What? dooky 02:12, 18 July 2006 (MST)
Weren't you the one who wrote the summaries for #1-ja through #38-ja? -- DENelson83 16:25, 18 July 2006 (MST)
Yes, over two years ago. They're timwe consuming to write and I was rather relying on other people taking up the job. Right now I'm just too busy to be writing summaries. I'm posting credits and production details when I can, but for now someone else is going to have to write the summaries. dooky 16:39, 18 July 2006 (MST)

Prelude to a personal request

I take it that WikiSysop is also known as Jadeite2? May I ask him/her myself?

(is afraid) -- DENelson83 23:40, 19 July 2006 (MST)

As far as I know, you're correct, and he's a he. 210 23:48, 19 July 2006 (MST)
I thought so. I bought his book (and am eagerly awaiting the next book in the WoL series), and I was wondering if I could have my presence at his forum reinstated. -- DENelson83 23:57, 19 July 2006 (MST)
Lucky you! Somehow I can't get the book even tho I want to (too difficult to explain). But from the samples I've read, it's pretty well-written. Just hope that Jay would one day make himself big enough that his works would be seen on the shelves of my local bookstores. 210 00:40, 20 July 2006 (MST)

I'll abstain my vote and ask the forum admins about letting you back in.--WikiSysop 02:07, 20 July 2006 (MST)

Denelson: Send me an e-mail via the contact form on the Genvid website.--WikiSysop 16:51, 20 July 2006 (MST)
Sent. DENelson83 18:23, 20 July 2006 (MST)

Database errors

I'm having trouble editing Sailor Buri; it keeps giving me a database error. dooky 03:59, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Me too. SQL code being tampered? Data corruption? Youma? 210 04:37, 21 July 2006 (MST)
How about moving the page (I can't do it as my unmovable on-screen keyboard overlaps the move page entry form)? 210 05:33, 21 July 2006 (MST)
Hmm. Seems to have corrected itself now. dooky 05:51, 21 July 2006 (MST)

Sys Clock

Just notice that the time in msg signatures & that shown in the "Recent Changes" list are diff. (7-hr discrepancy). Don't know if it matters tho. 210 04:35, 25 July 2006 (MST)

Check your preferences. Under "Date and time", look for offset. Does that help? -- DENelson83 05:52, 25 July 2006 (MST)
The readings of the server time & local time are the same in my preferences. Anyway, I'm not bothered by the difference. Just curious. 210 06:02, 25 July 2006 (MST)
You're right, that is strange. The server time is supposed to be UTC, but signatures show up in MST. I'm using a different time zone again (BST) so it's most confusing. Also, I think the date only changes at midnight MST, despite the server showing that it's past midnight in UTC (so you have a 7 hour period where the clock says it's after midnight, but still shows it as being the previous day). dooky 08:11, 25 July 2006 (MST)

WikiMoon Web

As the site grows in popularity, we're going to have people wanting to add articles on their own websites. Obviously, not all of these will be notable enough to qualify, strictly speaking, but removing people's links to their sites is going to cause all manner of tiresome drama. So, the proposed solution is WikiMoon Web, a subsection of fandom which will be for general links. Truly notable sites will still be labelled as such, but this area will hopefully be sufficient for people who just want to link their sites. So how should this work? Opinions? dooky 17:20, 26 July 2006 (MST)

So I guess this would be sthg like a fansite reviewing category page? If so someone has to review the articles & the sites concerned in order to label them as notable & state the reasons behind it. While welcoming this additional feature, I'd like to point out that this could be 1 hell of work. 210 17:48, 26 July 2006 (MST)
It's more of a place for people to plug their own sites. Basically, if a site is notable, then we won't have to rely on the owner to write an article about it - sites such as the Amazoness Quartet review site, Hitoshi Doi etc will all eventually get written about by people unconnected to them. It will still be a chellenge to decide what's truly notable, but this seems to be a better solution than banning minor sites from here altogether. dooky 18:04, 26 July 2006 (MST)
Yeah. Maybe you could just mark the links as sthg like "Editor's Choice", & all explanations for doing so could be done on the talk pages if challenged. But how to handle hentai sites? lol 210 18:20, 26 July 2006 (MST)
Editor's choice is a good idea since it leaves the decision in our hands. I'm not worried about hentai sites as long as they're labeled as such.--WikiSysop 20:24, 26 July 2006 (MST)